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 Post subject: Hunter's bend
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:59 pm 
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Does anyone use the hunter's bend to tie two ropes together for abseiling? What do you think of it? My dad showed me this knot the other day and it looks pretty neat to me and it is easy to tie (start like fisherman's, make a loop, tuck the ends through and pull tight) and untie. Not that I have anything against the double fisherman's...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:19 pm 
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunter%27s_bend

http://www.animatedknots.com/indexclimb ... dknots.com


Last edited by Drifter on Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:24 pm 
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Location: Gauteng, Pretoria
Rather use a figure 8 to join two ropes for abseiling from routes especially if the terrain the rope will run over during pulling is obstructed.
The two ropes forming the figure 8 knot will lie flat, leaving the knot itself standing upright when pulled over a surface preventing the knot catching on obstructions. Try it out you'll see how it works.
This practise is common in the Alps.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:45 pm 
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you mean the two ends on the same side of the knot? - makes sense, I'll try that, thanks. I'm not to keen on one end either side.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 5:55 pm 
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That is bad advice Gareth.

http://www.needlesports.com/advice/abseilknots.htm
http://www.xmission.com/~tmoyer/testing/EDK.html


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 7:57 pm 
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yikes! I tried it on a small diameter rope (7mm by the looks of it) and I'm knot gonna use the figure 8 not :? I've heard about the edk, but I thought they meant the overhand knot. I'm also not so keen trusting my life on the hunters knot now. I think (if it is indeed safe) the only advantage the hunter's knot has over the double fisherman's is that it unties easier. Guess I'll stick with double fisherman's unless I have a real concern about it getting snagged, then maybe I'll use the two overhand knots, that looks pretty save. I've used a double figure 8 with a safety knot either side, but that's a bit of a bfk (that mean a big knot Brolloks :wink: )


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 8:09 am 
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What I usually use is a reef knot with a stopper knot on either side. I think this is fairly common practice - certainly what I learnt to use when I started climbing. I've since used the overhand knot on occasion, but the fact that it can invert itself is slightly disconcerting. Also, the reef-stopper combo is super easy to undo...I suppose the one drawback is that it's quite a lot of knot :) but have never had an incident in which the KNOT has gotten stuck when being pulled.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 12:26 pm 
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Reef knot with stoppers? Sounds crap. Maybe if you have ropes of differing diameters...

For normal use an overhand knot with long tails is quick, safe and easy to untie. When you're doing multiple abseils, you'll thank me. You can go ahead and tie stopper knots on each side if that makes you feel safer and you have time to kill.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 2:37 pm 
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fanks shorti...

8)

_________________
you have one mouth, two ears. listen more...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 9:54 pm 
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Sam, I think another drawback is that you have to take some extra coins for the ferryman :shock: Dave I'm a little concerned here, \"Maybe if you have ropes of differing diameters...\" - are you serious?

np Brolloks :lol:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 6:50 am 
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http://www.chockstone.org/TechTips/JoinRopes.htm

I have never had a problem using a double fisherman knot to abseil. I know other people who have used the double fisherman knot for years as well for abseiling and they never had a problem with the knot either for this purpose.

Make sure the knot is really tight, pull the knot tight before you use it and check twice that you have done the knot correctly. I think this is a good practice.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 10:49 am 
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Nothing wrong with the double fishermans, except it can be difficult to untie when you have 7.5mm half ropes...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 12:15 pm 
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I think I showed Sam the reef knot thing. - The reef knot is NOT a rated climbing knot! The idea is that you tie a double fisherman's, except you insert a reef knot in the middle which makes it super easy to untie.

The benefit of the EDK is that it pulls over edges much better.
It does however require 'watching' that it doesn't pull through. Many will disagree on that point - citing that it has never budged in all their years of climbing. There are however enough widows out there who will tell you otherwise.
(and remember one is enough - don't think of the chances, think of the consequences)

Point Aside:
Several years ago the UIAGM syllabus said that the EDK was 'strictment interdit' - banned, no-go, forbidden and any guide using it lost his licsence.
Now its the recommended knot of choice and no other will do...


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