I got on the seemingly unpopular route Hannibal Lecter at Bronkies recently and thought it merited an upward revision in grade to 23. I'd argue that it's a full grade harder than neighbouring Memoirs of a Belay Bunny, which I would suggest should be down-graded to 22.

Let the spraying begin.

Cheers,

Ed

i have not been on hannibal lector but it does look hard for a 22.

memoirs is maybe a softish 23 but harder than any "solid" 22 i've climbed - the 1st moves can be very hard if you're not tall and the no-feet clip + gymnastic crux validates a 23 imho. and is definitely harder than "joint venture" that was downgraded to 22 from 23.

Check the route guide Hannibal has already been upgraded to a 23. Memoirs in my opinion is a 23 but a soft one if u have height advantage

I am currently working on Memoirs and I would give it 23. I can see how once it's waxed it could be perceived as soft, but it's certainly keeping me busy for now.

Hi

I agree that Hanibal Lecture is a full grade harder than Memoirs of Belay Bunny. I would make HL = 23 and MoBB = 22. MoBB is very soft compared to a 23 at Boven, it just does not justify a grade of 23.

If people feel that MoBB is a grade harder than Joint Venture, maybe that should be downgraded to a 21..

I also feel that Paranoia has a desperate move low down. In the region of 24+

Cheers
Andrew

My 2c is that the moves at the bottom of Memoirs are probably as hard as the move on Paranoia. That first move on Paranoia isn't so bad with the right beta. Compared to a few 22s and 23s at Choss, I think both are okay at 23. I've not done Hannibal, so I can't comment.

Beer as much as you can drink (after a day climbing with me, off course) for anyone who can guess what AC/DC song I can't help thinking of reading this

Joint Venture must be the most down graded climb ever - from 24 to 21! Memoirs, is the easiest route that side of the crag, probably as hard as Kate's Moss, eh Mokganjetsi. Less than a month before I win my bet

Can't say I know the song, as I can't claim to be a big AC/DC fan. I would agree with Andrew on the grade for Joint Venture. That said, I think it would be best to enlist some others to get more of a consensus grade. Anyone heard of http://www.mountainproject.com? One of the great things about this site, as an alternative to 8a.nu log-book, is that you can vote on a route's grade to get a consensus grade. There are currently no South African areas on there, but perhaps we can change that if people would be interested in giving it a try.

Once I have a bit more time, I'll see about posting Bronkies to the website as an experiment to gauge interest.

shorti: I'm not sure why I'm letting myself into this as I'm not a big fan of beer and don't know AC/DC very well, but my guess would be "Hard as a rock" ?

he shorti are you climbing again brah? missing you big time dude - gonna climb montagu stukkend this weekend!

okay the song: "for those about to rock, we salute you"?

my last 2c: no way is joint venture a 21- solid 22. memoirs has been a 23 like forever and everybody seemed happy with it - to downgrade it now simply because hannibal lecter is harder is maybe the wrong approach. how about a 23- and a 23+

Yup. I was researching for a climbing trip to the US and I came across it. Very nice presentation and loads of info. Waaay better than 8a (although I suppose they server slightly different purposes). Starting a SA section there will be much easier than starting an independant SA site. Maybe worth a look?

nope, wrong, but I like your answer enough Mok I would've gone climbing with your brother this weekend, but you just had to steal him. Emile, a wise man once said: Let there be light - and there was light, Let there be sound - and there was sound, Let there be guitars - there was guitars, Let there be drrrummms - there was drums, Let there be rock! ...and no, that wasn't it either, it was a terrible song

Not that I give a hooter, but my humble vote would be: Joint Venture 22, Memoirs 23, Hannibal Lecter - dunno, haven't tried it, it looks too difficult.

Why do we need yet another website to have to update a list of all our routes on?
If people want to comment on a route they can comment on the wiki itself - that way everything is in one place