Die onverklaarbaarheid in onsinnige ontbloting

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Keith
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Re: Die onverklaarbaarheid in onsinnige ontbloting

Postby Keith » Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:01 am

pierre.joubert wrote:I beg of you, unless your aim is to entirely fuck up the little freedom we climbers still have in this country, leave them out of this.


Hear, hear!

Although some of you with a kneejerk authoritarian streak think it fun to believe that there'll be no issues if "correct channels & permissions have been obtained", this is naive and may make matters worse.

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Justin
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Re: Die onverklaarbaarheid in onsinnige ontbloting

Postby Justin » Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:09 am

As per previous posts... if we don't regulate ourselves then we will be regulated by someone else.
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mattb595
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Re: Die onverklaarbaarheid in onsinnige ontbloting

Postby mattb595 » Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:04 am

I wasnt gonna go to this one but now im def keen from all this hype cant wait for it now! its like telling a kid not too touch that its expensive now he has too!

Warren G
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Re: Die onverklaarbaarheid in onsinnige ontbloting

Postby Warren G » Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:14 am

This conversation is running in circles without progressing an further. I agree with Friend1.0 comments regarding Boven: that area regrows so fast that paths disappear in one summer etc. But Cederberg isn't a high rainfall- fast growing neck of the woods, we just don't know enough about it to make a comment on regions of the Cederberg.

Continuing with the Boven comparison though the least damaging solution then would be to have a Rocklands rally in the already damaged areas, but I am still of the opinion that some areas need to be rested for periods of years. I have a huge respect for the Durban Climber's respect for the annual closure of Canyon due to nesting eagles: this works well because you are dealing with a small local community but this would be much harder to implement in Rocklands, as it would involve signage etc. I think it would be fun to have areas close for periods while others open, as it would provide a major motivations to climb the routes when you have a chance to, rather than when you want to. have big "Road Crew Opening" parties etc.

I suspect that if an EIA was conducted in Rocklands it would recommend the area be closed during the wet season to allow for the regrowth of endangered foliage. This wouldn't be a viable solution for foreigners, meaning many people will cheat the system. For this reason I think the multiple year closures and a heavy fine attached to these transgressions would be more viable. I don't get why people are apposed to a formal management system imposed on climbers by climbers to protect the areas we love- especially when we have so much bouldering in that area. this speaks of greed and lazyness
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friend1.0
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Re: Die onverklaarbaarheid in onsinnige ontbloting

Postby friend1.0 » Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:18 am

Point taken: "If it's a good idea, go ahead and do it, as it is much easier to apologize than to ask permission" etc. etc.

However, the question as to whether this festival is a "good idea" is still open to debate...I would agree with Logic (and Unio, Niel Mostert and others) that it is not.

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Re: Die onverklaarbaarheid in onsinnige ontbloting

Postby Nic Le Maitre » Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:22 am

friend1.0 wrote:Point taken: "If it's a good idea, go ahead and do it, as it is much easier to apologize than to ask permission" etc. etc.


No, it's not easier to ask for forgiveness than permission, the shitstorm around the via verrata in the 'Berg is a case in point
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Re: Die onverklaarbaarheid in onsinnige ontbloting

Postby friend1.0 » Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:34 am

This debate seems to the perfect forum to deal with an issue which I believe has not been properly concluded yet, namely the management of our high traffic areas like Rocklands. Much has been said about this, but no real conclusion has been reached. I would like to echo the sentiments of Warren and Justin: if we don't regulate ourselves, someone else will. I would think that the number of climbers who have voiced their concern regarding this festival should indicate that there are serious problems with it - if this is not a form of self-regulation by the climbing community then I don't know what is.

Keith
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Re: Die onverklaarbaarheid in onsinnige ontbloting

Postby Keith » Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:36 am

Ja well, for what it's worth, my point is simply...

Sometimes (often/usually?) it is best to ask for permission, whereas sometimes (occasionally/rarely??) it is best to not ask for permission.

Each case is different.

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Re: Die onverklaarbaarheid in onsinnige ontbloting

Postby mokganjetsi » Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:21 pm

finally had a good look at the ad - "NEW! Awesome secret location". The irony is thicker than grandma's glasses. well, this seems a bit like "damned if you do, damned if you don't" kind of situation. my impression is that the environmental impact was not really a top priority, although some right noises were made after the issue was raised. the promotion for the festival is simply "come climb in a new area; open lines; have fun".

ultimately, the environmental impact will equal the choices & actions of individuals. you have a choice. do the right thing.

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Justin
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Re: Die onverklaarbaarheid in onsinnige ontbloting

Postby Justin » Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:59 am

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