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PostPosted: Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:57 am 
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Hi guys.

Just wondering if i need to use bolt plates around cape town. I am aware it is mostly trad, and i am bringing a rack but was not sure how common it is to find bolt runners. Here in the blue mountains you always carry them, i am coming over for a 3 week climbing trip around.

cheers.


Last edited by bigfish on Tue Jul 16, 2013 7:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:39 am 
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Location: Cape Town
Real Name: Charles Edelstein
Nope. Routes that have bolts all have hangers


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 10:39 am 
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Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
Fortunately dastardly carrot bolts never made it to SA!


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 12:51 am 
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thanks guys. nice to know that i don't need to carry these over


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:47 am 
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What are carrot bolts? A new form of trad gear?


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 9:54 am 
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Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
I can google it for you?

http://www.climbingterms.com/post/25852362983/carrots


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2013 3:06 am 
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It is literally a Hex head bolt fixed into the wall. It was and is still used in sensitive areas in australia. It just means you have to carry hangers with you so you can slip it over the hex head, then put your draw into it. Some call it a form of trad because of the extra movement you have to do. They are allot more inconspicuous so the national parks and walker groups don't complain about them.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2013 7:49 am 
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Real Name: Justin Lawson
...and you carry them in your chalk bag.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:00 am 
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Most likely a lot less safe if you can just "slip" them over the head...they can just lift up when you climb above them & just "slip" themselves off. Bad enough that your biner can reposition itself on a bolt, now you have the hanger moving round...sounds like a recipe for disaster. I find it bad enough when hangers move around on climbs or are incorrectly orientated & now you are doing it deliberately? Hmm. Maybe a picture would help...

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Last edited by Old Smelly on Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:07 am 
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Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
They are designed so when you clip the biner in it prevents the hanger lifting off the bolt. If you want pics, I recommend Google. Again.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:27 am 
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Real Name: BrianG
a bit more elaboration on Carrot Bolts (& bolt plates)....i climbed in Western Oz last year and came across these dastardly things in a number of areas. as already mentioned, a carrot bolt is usually a normal bolt filed down into the shape of a "carrot" to be driven into a pre-drilled hole - essentially a type of piton. it differs from the more modern Oz option of gluing the un-filed bolt into the hole (in a similar way to glue-ins here). regardless the bolt-plate is then slotted over the bolt head and a biner/QD is clipped into the wide part of the "keyhole" to prevent it from sliding off. you still have the possibility of 360deg. rotation but unless biner or bolt head is too small (which does happen on occasion :shock: ) the likelihood of the bolt plate coming off is negligible. the scary part is that many of the "carrots" are in dubious condition with obvious corrosion in the hole. this coupled with the penchant for some long run-outs between them had me sh1ting myself on a few occasions

see http://www.climbing.co.za/2012/01/perma ... -overview/ for photos but NOTE esp. Marshall 1 ;-): bolt plate is incorrectly clipped in photo (needs to be rotated 180deg.).


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:54 am 
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Real Name: Justin Lawson
From the link above:

KEY HOLE HANGERS & CARROT BOLTS USED IN AUSTRALIA

A carrot bolt is a normally a 10mm machine bolt, with a slight taper to the end. Often the head is ground smaller to make fitting a key hole hanger easier. The bolt is whacked into a 10mm hole. Hangers are carried in chalk bag.

Image

PROS

Cheap. Hangers are reusable. Bolts from any workshop
Hangers don‟t rust
Limited training required
1 hole = less battery power & drilling time
No welds
Can be used immediately
Carrot is smaller thus less visible.

CONS

Difficult to use. Easy to drop hanger during clip
Whacking bolt in will cause stress in the metal
Bolts often not stainless
Cannot be used on overhanging lines

KEY HOLE HANGERS & CARROT BOLTS USED IN AUSTRALIA

Carrots are literally bolts bashed into under size holes. There will be some leverage & movement of the head.

Image

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2013 1:59 pm 
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Interesting that my observation remains true...unless you use a really huge carabiner to clip through the bolt you can unclip the whole attachment from the bolt, see

http://routes.sydneyrockies.org.au:8080 ... Id=2850856

It seems as stated above that the real issue is that these carrots are just whacked in...an Aussie even referred to it as a trad piece. Interesting & I am glad we don't do it :thumright

Enjoy your visit Big Fish.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 9:11 am 
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Real Name: Warren Gans
For a nation notorious for functional design I have always considered the Carrot the most un-Australian and thoroughly contrived invention. Why not a removable bolt- the rock too bad?! Getting an angle grinder to the rock to allow for cam placements would look natural after a few years and be far safer

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 12:41 pm 
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Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
It's called independent evolution (or something). When a population develops on its own far away from any other, strange things happen; echidnas, kangaroos, emus, platypus and carrot bolts.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 15, 2013 12:42 pm 
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Inventions such as these most probably originate to the days when Aussies devised unconventional ways to saw through iron bars.


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